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BMW footpath win: Reaction
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| Many protests have been held against BMW plans |
Car giant BMW was yesterday given permission to close a footpath cutting through its Cowley factory.
The manufacturer of the new Mini, wanted to "stop up" the Roman Way bridleway and footpath, off Horspath Road, but the Ramblers' Association and the British Horse Society contested the application.
Yesterday at Witney Magistrates' Court, District Judge Brian Loosley found in favour of BMW and gave the company permission to close the route.
Mr Loosley said that if the case was considered a "David and Goliath" situation, "this time Goliath has won".
BMW, which asked the county council make the application on security grounds, has agreed to provide an alternative footway and cycleway along the Eastern Bypass.
The judge's decision angered bridleway users, including the Ramblers' Association, which said it was "disappointed" by the decision.
John Orchard, a spokesman for the association in Oxfordshire, said: "We felt we had a case and could have won it but the judge felt otherwise.
"The decision today won't deter us from taking on this kind of case in future."
Troth Wells, of Tree Lane, Iffley, who is a member of the British Horse Society, and the Oxford Area Bridleways Association, added: "We are very disappointed with this decision which means riders will no longer be able to use this route to Shotover Park. I was riding my horse Copper there this morning."
The judge ordered the British Horse Society and Ramblers' Association to pay £27,700 legal costs and £19,800 costs respectively, to the county council.
Rebecca Baxter, a spokesman for BMW, said the decision would mean the company could "better utilise" its existing site.
She added: "We are grateful that we can now proceed with planning for the future.
"We have made a commitment to providing an alternative route and will be starting work on that within the next 16 weeks.
"The project will take six months from start to finish. In the meantime, cyclists and pedestrians will still be able to use the existing route until the new path and cycleway is completed and signed off by Oxfordshire County Council."
5:50pm Monday 15th October 2007
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CommentPosted by: bob johnson, ox on 6:12pm Mon 15 Oct 07
i hear andrew smith supported BMW,can`t wait untill the next general election mate.
i hear andrew smith supported BMW,can`t wait untill the next general election mate.
Posted by: Stu, Oxford on 7:19pm Mon 15 Oct 07
In all the years I've lived in Oxford I have never seena horse go down the bridleway until the threat of closure was started. Where the hell would you go once you get to the BBL end of it anyway. These people are just bored and like to stir up trouble. Besides which it was never the nicest path with lots of gangs hanging out down there.
In all the years I've lived in Oxford I have never seena horse go down the bridleway until the threat of closure was started. Where the hell would you go once you get to the BBL end of it anyway. These people are just bored and like to stir up trouble. Besides which it was never the nicest path with lots of gangs hanging out down there.
Posted by: Stephen Fisher, Stonesfield on 7:29pm Mon 15 Oct 07
Does anyone remember Tony Blair’s commitment to opening up the countryside?
The closing of this 2000 year old right of way is an affront to all that is decent.
Historical precedence and the needs of local people lose to the wants of big business.
Does anyone remember Tony Blair’s commitment to opening up the countryside?
The closing of this 2000 year old right of way is an affront to all that is decent.
Historical precedence and the needs of local people lose to the wants of big business.
Posted by: JohnY, Bicester on 8:14pm Mon 15 Oct 07
How about BMW paying the costs that were awarded against the two chaities?.
This can come out of the extra profit that they will make from the ability of BMW to "Better Utilise" this ancient Right of Way.
How about BMW paying the costs that were awarded against the two chaities?.
This can come out of the extra profit that they will make from the ability of BMW to "Better Utilise" this ancient Right of Way.
Posted by: Sol, Worlds End on 5:39am Tue 16 Oct 07
Thats how it is when you let the Germans have things.
Two wars were fought to stop this from happening.
Thats how it is when you let the Germans have things.
Two wars were fought to stop this from happening.
Posted by: Mickey, Cowley on 8:38am Tue 16 Oct 07
I have to agree with the last post, we couldnt look after the factory, our pride & joy of Oxford & what arguably made Oxford what it is today so we sell it to the Germans along with one of the best inventions of british history (the mini), they repay us like this, give them an inch & they'll take a mile just like any "goliath" business...apparantl
y 400 journeys a week were made down there on horseback. Wont be much fun riding a horse alongside a dual carriageway!
I have to agree with the last post, we couldnt look after the factory, our pride & joy of Oxford & what arguably made Oxford what it is today so we sell it to the Germans along with one of the best inventions of british history (the mini), they repay us like this, give them an inch & they'll take a mile just like any "goliath" business...apparantl
y 400 journeys a week were made down there on horseback. Wont be much fun riding a horse alongside a dual carriageway!
Posted by: Stu, Oxford on 9:46am Tue 16 Oct 07
Mickey, get your facts straight. The 400 journies were made mostly by people going into the factory. Horses only ever went up there when they learnt it was going to be closed. Once you get to the Watlington Road, where are the horses going to go? I sincerly doubt most people even knew of the path until the closure was mentioned.
Mickey, get your facts straight. The 400 journies were made mostly by people going into the factory. Horses only ever went up there when they learnt it was going to be closed. Once you get to the Watlington Road, where are the horses going to go? I sincerly doubt most people even knew of the path until the closure was mentioned.
Posted by: Brian, BBleys on 7:12pm Tue 16 Oct 07
all the local [italic][bold]labour[/bold][/italic] city & county councillors were for the the closure didn't want to upset BMW. at least the IWCA stood against the closure. interesting to me was that the case was heard in witney of all places, why not in oxford city??
all the local
labour city & county councillors were for the the closure didn't want to upset BMW. at least the IWCA stood against the closure. interesting to me was that the case was heard in witney of all places, why not in oxford city??
Posted by: A Ward, Oxford on 10:56pm Tue 16 Oct 07
Seems like we have a split down the middle. If you have any criticism blame the charities for such a poor defence. Some of the evidence put up was ropey. We may not like it but it might protect the jobs in Oxford for the sake of a hookey path that was not looked after. Why does no-one mention that!!!
Seems like we have a split down the middle. If you have any criticism blame the charities for such a poor defence. Some of the evidence put up was ropey. We may not like it but it might protect the jobs in Oxford for the sake of a hookey path that was not looked after. Why does no-one mention that!!!
Posted by: tomo, headington on 11:22pm Tue 16 Oct 07
i remember when i used to use that right of way as a kid to cut from woodfarm to the sunday market in bbleys. my mother used to tell me to go that way as it was much safer. than the bypass.and i remember horses using this route aswell.and that was back in the 70s. but hey i give the germans there due at least they won somthing . anyway how can a judge from witney give this permission to close it..i bet hes a german too realy...the good old days have gone. soon all germans will be english judges. wont they mr loosley . never mind im sure you will all feel much safer now walking beside the bypass. hope my children never use it ....
i remember when i used to use that right of way as a kid to cut from woodfarm to the sunday market in bbleys. my mother used to tell me to go that way as it was much safer. than the bypass.and i remember horses using this route aswell.and that was back in the 70s. but hey i give the germans there due at least they won somthing . anyway how can a judge from witney give this permission to close it..i bet hes a german too realy...the good old days have gone. soon all germans will be english judges. wont they mr loosley . never mind im sure you will all feel much safer now walking beside the bypass. hope my children never use it ....
Posted by: T Wells, Oxford on 7:15pm Wed 17 Oct 07
As a horserider who used/uses the bridleway I am deeply upset by the judgement and by penalising two charities who were trying to defend the public right of way. We only learned of this link to Shotover Country Park in March 2006 and have riden Roman Way approx 2-3 times a month since then. People including horseriders cannot lose our access to the countryside - we need to be able to get to our green spaces and use our RIGHTS OF WAY.
As a horserider who used/uses the bridleway I am deeply upset by the judgement and by penalising two charities who were trying to defend the public right of way. We only learned of this link to Shotover Country Park in March 2006 and have riden Roman Way approx 2-3 times a month since then. People including horseriders cannot lose our access to the countryside - we need to be able to get to our green spaces and use our RIGHTS OF WAY.
Posted by: mrs J Lochhead, Scotland on 1:24am Thu 18 Oct 07
Our neighbours and ourselves have a path next to our houses which belongs to us.The title deeds are quite clear who owns the path, it is private land.We have suffered for years due to anti-social behaviour and put up gates to stop the thugs from entering.They were damaging our properties,cursing and swearing and throwing their empty bottles into our gardens. We applied for planning permission and the council refused it so we went to the Scottish Executive to appeal it and because the council did not give the executive the complete details of our private path they also refused it. The council then served us with an enforcement notice and we had to find a planning specialist solicitor who advised us that we had a very strong case. We then took the council to a public enquiry and won our case.However as working class people we had to pay out thousands of pounds to fight for our rights.Both our neighbours and ourselves have been quite ill due to all the trouble we have had to deal with due to the thugs and also the way the council treated us.Our neighbour collapsed 4 times and his wife was taken to hospital with chest pains due to the anxiety of it all.The lane in question is 1 metre wide and the so called Access Officer at the council said the thugs have the right to drink on our land.We live in an urban setting not in the country where the cows roam the fields.We have now set a precedent and Ann Gloag who owns Stagecoach buses also won her case for total privacy. We were delighted to see BMW had won their case.We fought this for 5-6 years and it was really stressful however it was worth it in the end.People should have the right to privacy in their own homes.I like to walk in the country as well however I use the access code and would never alarm or go near anyones property invading their privacy. Well done BMW
Our neighbours and ourselves have a path next to our houses which belongs to us.The title deeds are quite clear who owns the path, it is private land.We have suffered for years due to anti-social behaviour and put up gates to stop the thugs from entering.They were damaging our properties,cursing and swearing and throwing their empty bottles into our gardens. We applied for planning permission and the council refused it so we went to the Scottish Executive to appeal it and because the council did not give the executive the complete details of our private path they also refused it. The council then served us with an enforcement notice and we had to find a planning specialist solicitor who advised us that we had a very strong case. We then took the council to a public enquiry and won our case.However as working class people we had to pay out thousands of pounds to fight for our rights.Both our neighbours and ourselves have been quite ill due to all the trouble we have had to deal with due to the thugs and also the way the council treated us.Our neighbour collapsed 4 times and his wife was taken to hospital with chest pains due to the anxiety of it all.The lane in question is 1 metre wide and the so called Access Officer at the council said the thugs have the right to drink on our land.We live in an urban setting not in the country where the cows roam the fields.We have now set a precedent and Ann Gloag who owns Stagecoach buses also won her case for total privacy. We were delighted to see BMW had won their case.We fought this for 5-6 years and it was really stressful however it was worth it in the end.People should have the right to privacy in their own homes.I like to walk in the country as well however I use the access code and would never alarm or go near anyones property invading their privacy. Well done BMW
Posted by: Paul, Oxford on 10:57am Fri 19 Oct 07
[bold]So where are the £££ headlines Oxford mail? [/bold] when are you going to shout about the County Council and BMW forcing two charities to cough up a huge £50k just for trying to defend public rights? These rights of way are highways and part of our shared heritage...whether people use them on a day to day basis or not. BMW have only been here since 1995, and we can be pretty certain that they will not be here in 2015, so well done to the 'establishment' for allowing them to remove this route. OK it was a bit grotty -but thats not the point as it could easily have been improved and made more enjoyable to use - OR a much better 'green' alternative for all users could have been found around the BMW site. Its so short sited - these routes have been used in the past, now, and are there for future needs, and we have let this one slip through our fingers. I just hope that BMW and OCC play fair by at least waiving their claim for costs.
So where are the £££ headlines Oxford mail? when are you going to shout about the County Council and BMW forcing two charities to cough up a huge £50k just for trying to defend public rights? These rights of way are highways and part of our shared heritage...whether people use them on a day to day basis or not. BMW have only been here since 1995, and we can be pretty certain that they will not be here in 2015, so well done to the 'establishment' for allowing them to remove this route. OK it was a bit grotty -but thats not the point as it could easily have been improved and made more enjoyable to use - OR a much better 'green' alternative for all users could have been found around the BMW site. Its so short sited - these routes have been used in the past, now, and are there for future needs, and we have let this one slip through our fingers. I just hope that BMW and OCC play fair by at least waiving their claim for costs.
Posted by: Chris Beney, Bushey on 11:36am Sun 21 Oct 07
Mrs Lochhead of Scotland seems to equate owning the underlying land with owning the right of way. I can't speak for Scotland but in England most rights of way are owned by the local Highway Authority (on behalf of the public at large) under Highways Act 1980 S263. This is a kind of joint ownership, but true ownership nevertheless.
As for loutish behaviour, throwing bottles into gardens etc., I am at one with Mrs Lochhead in condemning it. But lets hear no more of the 'private property' winge.
Mrs Lochhead of Scotland seems to equate owning the underlying land with owning the right of way. I can't speak for Scotland but in England most rights of way are owned by the local Highway Authority (on behalf of the public at large) under Highways Act 1980 S263. This is a kind of joint ownership, but true ownership nevertheless.
As for loutish behaviour, throwing bottles into gardens etc., I am at one with Mrs Lochhead in condemning it. But lets hear no more of the 'private property' winge.
Posted by: A.Taylor, Scotland on 1:00am Mon 29 Oct 07
The point is that the alternative path offered is not for use by horse riders![bold]bold[/bold]
The point is that the alternative path offered is not for use by horse riders!
Posted by: Freddy, Oxford on 5:06pm Mon 29 Oct 07
Well Done BMW,
In the past, both the Ramblers' Association and the British Horse Society have campaigned for the banning of motor vehicles from using BOATs (Byways Open to All Traffic).
Nice to see that the motor industry has done the same to the Ramblers' Association and the British Horse Society and spoilt their enjoyment of the so called “countryside” of Roman Way.
As to paying for the costs, both the Ramblers' Association and the British Horse Society are charities that can easily afford it. If they couldn’t then why did they both decide to fight it?
I used to cycle from Horspath to a Watlington Road industrial estate and back again each working day, a long time before the Horspath cycle track was built. I used to cycle via Roman Way, through the factory, and down the narrow path which ends where Lidl now stands.
I have never seen a horse use that area, nor have I ever seen any sign (hoof prints, muck, etc) of a horse ever using that area.
Well Done BMW,
In the past, both the Ramblers' Association and the British Horse Society have campaigned for the banning of motor vehicles from using BOATs (Byways Open to All Traffic).
Nice to see that the motor industry has done the same to the Ramblers' Association and the British Horse Society and spoilt their enjoyment of the so called “countryside” of Roman Way.
As to paying for the costs, both the Ramblers' Association and the British Horse Society are charities that can easily afford it. If they couldn’t then why did they both decide to fight it?
I used to cycle from Horspath to a Watlington Road industrial estate and back again each working day, a long time before the Horspath cycle track was built. I used to cycle via Roman Way, through the factory, and down the narrow path which ends where Lidl now stands.
I have never seen a horse use that area, nor have I ever seen any sign (hoof prints, muck, etc) of a horse ever using that area.
Posted by: sue cox, charlbury on 6:19pm Sun 4 Nov 07
This route has existed as a right of way for horses, and unmotorised traffic since roman times and the fact that is has not been used as such by horses regularly should not be relevant to continuing similar rights on an alternative route. BMW has enough money to provide one that is pleasant and suitable (ie including as a convenient short cut) for all users, not just its' employees.
Routes used by walkers, cyclists and horse riders are generally chosen in order to get away from the noise, smell and possible danger of motorised traffic in close proximity, so the one they are providing is for 2 of these user groups is hardly ideal.
This route has existed as a right of way for horses, and unmotorised traffic since roman times and the fact that is has not been used as such by horses regularly should not be relevant to continuing similar rights on an alternative route. BMW has enough money to provide one that is pleasant and suitable (ie including as a convenient short cut) for all users, not just its' employees.
Routes used by walkers, cyclists and horse riders are generally chosen in order to get away from the noise, smell and possible danger of motorised traffic in close proximity, so the one they are providing is for 2 of these user groups is hardly ideal.
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